Another Mormon goes to jail

[hitchiker]

High profile mormon and ex Bishop , Steven Pokere has just recieved four years jail , Steven is also an ex all black , ( nz rugby team ) ,
the interesting thing about this is it all happened before about six years ago as my former stake president got a five year term for financial fraud .
Steven was a accountant for a financial investment firm which was set up completely by members , they lost 13 million nz dollars of friends family and mormon community money , both cases involved niaeve members investing money in shonky overseas schemes , as things went wrong they simply rounded up more money from stupid members who trusted them because of there high profile in the church .
question is , is this all part of the basic reality gene being missing among mormon people , did they trust fasting prayer and church status rarther than sound financial advice

[peter_mary]

I have heard my Father in Law state on more than one occassion, "It's a good investment...he's a good member of the Church." It's as if that's all that matters. To date, he has not been robbed blind, but he hasn't gotten rich, either.

Peter_Mary

[dogzilla]

I just had a conversation with my TBM father that reminded me of the harsh reality of brainwashing -- it's not just money, but also health care. I'm sorry to say the conversation made my level of respect for my father slip a few notches.

Like everyone else in my Scottish + German heritage family, he has high cholesterol. He's known for years how to combat this: exercise, eat a low-fat diet consistently, don't smoke, and so on. He also knows that both garlic and cayenne pepper are very good for helping lower cholesterol. (He used to make garlic, onion, and cayenne sandwiches, which I'm sure my step-mother appreciated.)

His doc told him to take Lipitor, but he doesn't like it; he says it makes him feel bad.

So some numbnuts at church has turned him on to this former chiropractor (quack alert!) who has become a "naturopath (http://skepdic.com/natpathy.html)." I'm suspicious of any one who hasn't actually been through medical school, giving medical advice. I told him what I've read about naturopathy and how it's mostly ridiculous, nonscientific nonsense. Some things may have a placebo effect; if you think it works, it will, but for the most part, he's wasting his money.

I kept asking him why he wanted to spend his money on this when he knows fully well how to manage his cholesterol without some freaking snake-oil salesmen trying to sell him magical cures. He insisted that since this trusted church member swears by the guy, he's going to at least give it a shot and see what he has to say. At this point, I realized Dad is no stranger to magical thinking and if anyone could swallow the First Vision story, chiropractors and naturopaths are only a half a step beyond that.

Clearly, my dad -- if he ever had the ability -- has lost the ability to discern a con when he sees one. Nor would he listen to me, which is surprising since he usually does take my opinion to heart. Whatever, if he wants to set his hard-earned money on fire, I'm not going to stand in his way. But I will tell him how stupid it is. We ended the conversation with me quoting his own words back at him, (he used to say this a lot when I was a teenager and knew everything), "Hey, do it your own dumb, stupid way, if you want." He laughed, but we both knew he's going to pursue this nonsense.

The only thing that pisses me off about the situation is how typical this is. He has always been so tight with money that he'd argue with me if I asked him for tuition money in college. I didn't expect him to foot the entire bill, just help me out once in a while. Yet he thinks nothing of giving up his money to some brainwashing cult or any random shyster that the cult recommends.

Gah. :duh

Note: After checking on my own link above, I noticed that naturopaths like to prescribe coffee enemas. I wonder if the WOW allows TBMs to shoot coffee up their butts instead of drinking it? :D I guess if he lets it cool down first, it might be okay...

Ooo, and this is interesting, "Why Health Professionals Become Quacks" (http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/quackpro.html) Or, "why random dudes in NY start religions to become profits."

[lunaverse]

I think some alternative medicine is valid, but it's best to take an open-minded skeptical approach. Research is the key.

Homepathy (which is different from naturopathy, I think) may have some merit. A scientist in France has done some very interesting research, and his method is very scientific. But the point again is to research.

I don't trust mainstream medicine 100% either. Sometimes it is more profitable to treat symptoms if they're not fatal, than it is to cure them. I don't think individual doctors are as guilty as the pharms and AMA (the corrupt people seek power, the guy who really wants to help tends to keep his own practice).

For example, allergies. Not many people die of allergies, and it's a billion dollar industry to sell anti-hystimines.

There's an alt method called "NAET" which claims to actually cure allergies. Not much has been done in the way of clinical research, but in desparation, I tried it on my son. He was cured of several allergies (as in, they no longer showed up on the RAST test, and he no longer threw up upon eating eggs). The alt doctor (who also had an MD) also ran additional tests and discovered my son had celiac disease -- something the mainstream doctors hadn't caught, and something that could have caused my son severe health issues later in life had we not begun treatment early.

Again, the important thing is research. It's your body, educate yourself as best you can about your condition. Don't trust *anyone* blindly, be it an MD or a quack. And if it's not working, be prepared to change doctors, methods, whatever.

Luna

[noodle]

Note: After checking on my own link above, I noticed that naturopaths like to prescribe coffee enemas. I wonder if the WOW allows TBMs to shoot coffee up their butts instead of drinking it? :D I guess if he lets it cool down first, it might be okay...


Zilla, only decaf coffee enemas are approved. :D

mamajama

[free thinker]

Note: After checking on my own link above, I noticed that naturopaths like to prescribe coffee enemas. I wonder if the WOW allows TBMs to shoot coffee up their butts instead of drinking it? I guess if he lets it cool down first, it might be okay...


Make it a grande. :cool:

free thinker