Nephite burial mounds

[wileycoyote]

I just heard the story of "Zelf" :confused: ( I think that's the name). He was the guy that Joseph identified from bones that someone had dug up and brought to him. We heard how the Nephites buried people. They put one layer of dead people on the ground in a big circle. Like a big pizza. Then covered them with a layer of dirt. Then put a slightly smaller layer of bodies on top of the dirt, then dirt,bodies,dirt,etc. We heard that Zelf was dug from the top of one of these mounds that was 100 feet high :duh

Did the description of this burial process come from the Bom,Joseph, or actual physical evidence somewhere?

[free thinker]

I just heard the story of "Zelf" ( I


During the march of Zions Camp they came upon a skeleton that was rather large. Joseph stated it was a nephite named Zelph. Then went on to describe him in some detail.

Just another yarn spun by old Joe. He was quite a story teller that Joe.

ft

[peter_mary]

The following is taken from the writings of LDS Apostle Joseph Fielding Smith:

JOSEPH SMITH LOCATES CUMORAH IN WESTERN NEW YORK.

Perhaps this matter could rest at this point, but the question of the territory now embraced within the United States having been in possession of Nephites and Lamanites before the death of Mormon, carries some weight in the determining of this matter. In the light of revelation it is absurd for anyone to maintain that the Nephites and Lamanites did not possess this northern land. While Zion's camp was marching on the way to Jackson County [Missouri], near the bank of the Illinois River [in Illinois] they came to a mound containing the skeleton of a man. The history of this incident is as follows:

"The brethren procured a shovel and a hoe, and removing the earth to the depth of about one foot, discovered the skeleton of a man, almost entire, and between his ribs the stone point of a Lamanitish arrow, which evidently produced his death. Elder Burr Riggs retained the arrow. The contemplation of the scenery around us produced peculiar sensations in our bosoms; and subsequently the visions of the past being opened to my understanding by the Spirit of the Almighty, I discovered that the person whose skeleton was before us was a white Lamanite, a large, thickset man, and a man of God. His name was Zelph. He was a warrior and chieftain under the great prophet Onandagus, who was known from the Hill Cumorah, or eastern sea to the Rocky Mountains. The curse was taken from Zelph, or at least, in part—one of his thigh bones was broken by a stone flung from a sling, while in battle, years before his death. He was killed in battle by the arrow found among his ribs, during the last great struggle of the Lamanites and Nephites."

HEBER C. KIMBALL TELLS OF DEATH OF ZELPH.

Elder Heber C. Kimball who was present recorded the following in his journal:

"While on our way we felt anxious to know who the person was who had been killed by that arrow. It was made known to Joseph that he had been an officer who fell in battle, in the last destruction among the Lamanites, and his name was Zelph. This caused us to rejoice much, to think that God was so mindful of us as to show these things to his servant. Brother Joseph had inquired of the Lord, and it was made known in a vision."

Joseph Smith was reknowned for his ability to spin a yarn about the natives of the land, and it largely helps to explain his ability to dictate the Book of Mormon itself. Zelph is in the same category.

A while back, Helemon posted a hilarious link to an e-bay site that was selling a Zelph skeleton action figure...funniest damn thing I'd seen in ages! :D

[aaronlfa]

Wow, I totally forgot about that storey unitl I read that post. Someone else posted this the last time the subject came up on the forum, but I dug up a link to the online copy of the Book of Zelph (thanks to Helemon).

THE BOOK OF ZELPH
ANOTHER TESTAMENT OF THE BOOK OF MORMON
http://www.bookofzelph.com/

It is pretty funny and pretty original. While I am not a big fan of making fun of tscc, this made my laugh and think, wow what Josph Smith did really wasn't all that tough to do if you had the right personality. The guy who translated the Book of Zelph from ancient indian leather plates seems to have a lot of spare time. I still enjoyed it.

[Jeff_Ricks]

Wow, I totally forgot about that storey unitl I read that post. Someone else posted this the last time the subject came up on the forum, but I dug up a link to the online copy of the Book of Zelph (thanks to Helemon).

THE BOOK OF ZELPH
ANOTHER TESTAMENT OF THE BOOK OF MORMON
http://www.bookofzelph.com/

It is pretty funny and pretty original. While I am not a big fan of making fun of tscc, this made my laugh and think, wow what Josph Smith did really wasn't all that tough to do if you had the right personality. The guy who translated the Book of Zelph from ancient indian leather plates seems to have a lot of spare time. I still enjoyed it.
I love the Book of Zelph! I just might convert! ;) My favorite character isn't Zelph or the son of Zelph (Melph) It's not Abitch either. My favorite one is the son of Abitch. :D Too funny!

Jeff

[lunaverse]

A TBM friend of mine once asked me how JS could have made up the Book of Mormon with all its stories and weird names. This surprised me, because this friend reads sci-fi!

I told him I had written a few hundred thousand words of stories with fantastic worlds and people with strange names. I also told him if I really wanted to, I could write a book of scripture about as long as the BoM in King James English.

I wasn't aware of the Book of Zelph or I would have steered him there. :) But the sci-fi analogy really got him. He'll probably never use that "proof" of the BoM again...

Luna

[free thinker]

It is pretty funny and pretty original. While I am not a big fan of making fun of tscc, this made my laugh and think, wow what Josph Smith did really wasn't all that tough to do if you had the right personality. The guy who translated the Book of Zelph from ancient indian leather plates seems to have a lot of spare time. I still enjoyed it.
__________________
Aaron

But did it get him laid? See if you produce something like that you have to parlay it man. Use the leverage.

If in the end it doesn't get you laid, it was an excersize in futility. :cool:

ft

[wileycoyote]

Thanks everyone,
I heard this story (Zelph) in a chapel full of adults in a class on JS. More amazing to me than the stories, was the fact that the crowd kept gasping and aaaahhhhing at all the amazing events surrounding JS. I think next class I should take a check list of "how cult leaders control people" and mark off all the items as the instructor does them. I think he hits as many of those as he does JS facts. :Puking I seriously feel like I got dropped into a Twilight Zone episode. I don't hang around to chat and partake of the atmosphere after the class is over, I'm pretty much freaked out and I get the heck out of there. :eek:

[lunaverse]

WileyC, will you share your notes with me? Please???

I've been thinking of infiltrating, to re-evaulate the typical Sunday block with my new knowledge, but I'm too chicken. :) I could probably pull it off though.

Luna

[wileycoyote]

Luna,
Is heightened paranoi a stage of po-mo experience. I've got it. :o With all the networking that goes in my community, I'm a little uncomfortable giving you all the details about the class. It would be easy to recognize the class and not that much harder to pick me out. The guy who teaches us has serious connections. He flat out told us that the church keeps track of all the people who oppose it. I guess it started as a revelation in the D+C and they still take it pretty seriously today.
I think my neighbors know I've got a testimony issue and I don't go to church anymore. That's good enough for me and I think they can live with that too. I look up to William Law but I can't be like him yet. Best not to say to much for now. :)
Wil

[wileycoyote]

P.S. The sunday block,imo, isn't worth the hassle doctrinely. You mostly just sit there being frustrated because of all the things that are going by unsaid.But, If you go with the thought " I don't think this is true, so how does it work?" the three hours can be very interesting. I think the church could pretty much teach most of this stuff we know(well, maybe not how cults work) and the church would still survive and thrive because it all works based on the social set up. It's just amazing to see it all in action. :D

[lunaverse]

Wiley, I totally understand. :)

I may have to do the legwork myself.

Mainly, I would feel uncomfortable about being in the Church on false pretenses. No one would have any inkling I was anything other than a visitor from another ward, nevertheless I'm not very good at pretending. :)

Or I could really shake things up, if someone asked, I could be totally honest, lol.

Luna