Evolution Deceit - An Idiot's Tale

[helemon]

http://www.jabberwockee.com/archives/2006/01/evolution_deceit_an_idiots_tal_1.php
www.evolutiondeceit.com
What makes evolutiondeceit.com different is that it is the attempt by a Muslim to discredit the facts of evolution. What is interesting to see is that the same pathetic application of fuzzy-logic seems to be the one consistency in Godiots worldwide.

As it is stated in the Koran, "We hurl the truth against falsehood, and it knocks out its brain." (Surat al-Anbiya, 18)

As it is stated by thinking people, “We toss a little truth at the Koran, and it shakes out the shit.” (Logic, reason, and provable fact)

The great intellectual Oktar makes such earth-shattering arguments as:

“The Theory of Evolution has Collapsed

The theory of evolution is a theory that fails at the very first step. The reason is that evolutionists are unable to explain even the formation of a single protein. Neither the laws of probability nor the laws of physics and chemistry offer any chance for the fortuitous formation of life.

Does it sound logical or reasonable when not even a single chance-formed protein can exist, that millions of such proteins combined in an order to produce the cell of a living thing; and that billions of cells managed to form and then came together by chance to produce living things; and that from them generated fish; and that those that passed to land turned into reptiles, birds, and that this is how all the millions of different species on earth were formed?

Even if it does not seem logical to you, evolutionists do believe this fable.”

Well, jumping Jehosephat! Then it must have all been made by an omniscient being that always existed without a creator! I’m throwing away my chemistry set! It’s the Koran for me from here out…ass in the air…allah…allah…in your ****ing dreams!

[bobcat]

Yeah, evolution does "fail" at this first step, but so what? I'd rather start with a theory that can't explain the most distant origins of life than a theory that can't explain SHIT about much more accesable things, like fossil records and carbon dating. And even worse, ID doesn't do any better of a job at explaining the very beginnings of life than evolution does. It just pushes the beginnings back even further and tries to declare it in a safe zone where we shouldn't tread (i.e. we can't understand God's methods)? And they want to teach this in science classes? Uggh.

[lunaverse]

And when you look at Chaos Theory, you find that probabilities get weird... Patterns that begin small will reinforce each other until they become an unshiftable pattern.

Chances are those protein developments were some type of chemical-event feedback loop -- possibly something unavoidable under certain specific circumstances. I think chaos theory will one day easily explain it away (and possibly give us the tools to recreate the event).

It may be no more (or just as) complicated as a vortex in a stream.

Luna

[aether]

Saying that the theory of evolution is flawed because we don't know how proteins are made (which is not entirely correct anyway) makes about as much sense as saying "since we can't see atoms, they don't exist, therefore matter does not exist, therefore we don't exist." Just because we can't see the answer doesn't mean it's not there. And besides, it would be a fallacy to make things even more complicated by assuming that an intelligent designer intervened in the creation of proteins.

[peter_mary]

You know, what's funny to me is that the creationists want to discredit evolution because we don't know how it happened, but do we really have any more information on how creation happened?

God did it.

Does that really explain anything? Without explaination, its just magic.

In a sense, let's say "Creation fails at the first step. The reason is that creationists are unable to explain the formation of God. Neither the laws of probability nor the laws of physics and chemistry, logic nor reason offer any chance for the fortuitous formation of God.

Does it sound logical or reasonable when there is no external, testable, incontrovertable evidence of God, that such an improbable being can exist, and that as such, He then organized matter into millions of proteins in an order to produce the cell of a living thing; and that billions of cells managed to form and then came together by chance to produce living things; and that from them generated fish; and that those that passed to land turned into reptiles, birds, and that this is how all the millions of different species on earth were formed?

Even if it does not seem logical to you, creationists do believe this fable.”

What's the difference, really, whether you have faith in "chance" or "God"? Either way you don't know how the hell it works...except that with the "chance" model, you at least have a chance of figuring it out. With the "God" model, you never will. It will be a mystery forever.

I think I'll throw in with chance...

[elder_nomo]

.......
.......creationists are unable to explain the formation of God. Neither the laws of probability nor the laws of physics and chemistry, logic nor reason offer any chance for the fortuitous formation of God.
.......

Using ID logic:
God is too complex a being to have sprung up out of nowhere.
Therefore there must be an intelligent God-designer.

[peter_mary]

Using ID logic:
God is too complex a being to have sprung up out of nowhere.
Therefore there must be an intelligent God-designer.
EXACTLY my point!

[skeptic]

But first, one of my favorite quotes:

The Church says the Earth is Flat, but I know that it is round, for I have seen the Shadow of the Moon, I have more faith in a Shadow then in the Church.
(Magellan, 1480-1521) Guildworks, pg. 143, 1971 by Miriam C. Hunter.

“Eratosthenes” (third century B.C.) determined the Earth was round by measuring the shadows of two sticks placed a distance apart.

__________________________________________________ __


In visiting with the J.W.’s at the door they left me with their little book. ‘Life- How did it get here? By evolution or creation?

The book is full of Strawman Arguments, like Huge Gulfs- Can Evolution Bridge them. I started a response, but have just about decided why waist my valuable time. The J.W.’s that come to the door are not even knowledgeable on the subject. Eric Hoffer wrote: “In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists.”

Helemon, I’m getting off your subject, but if I could share my experience with Islam. TBM wife has an older brother who has worked abroad all his life. Several years back he was working in Malaysia and happened to fall in love with and married very beautiful Malaysian lady. She is very kind and sweet lady as well is her family. We feel very close to them.

Brother in law had to convert to Islam to marry her. (Sound familiar) He was baptized LDS, never active. He does not buy into Islam. (well maybe the part where he can have 3 additional wives) While visiting them he copied some verses out of the Koran for me. One about if your wife is not living according to the teachings of Allah. First you advise her to change her ways, if that doesn’t work you deny her your bed, if that does not work you are allowed to beat her lightly. (Surah 4. An-Nisa Part 5 vs. 34)

We were taken to the new Putrajarah (sp) Mosque. (Their counter part to temple square, only it holds like 15,000 people, has a beautiful man made lake around it) At the front of the Mosque it lists the purity requirements to be able to enter. One amused me as it stated “Women” who were menstruating could not enter. I later asked my Muslim sister in law why Allah might have with this. I could sense her brain start to question and then hit a brick wall. (They are taught well, not to question authority) However, sister in law has a problem with polygamy. Some of her sisters are plural wives and she realizes it certainly is a Sacred Loneliness. This last year they came to visit, so I took them to see the Grand Canyon. On the way I was able to make arrangement for FLDS apostate and author Ben Bistline to meet us and share with them his experiences at Colorado City over lunch.( Ben has spoken to our Post Mormon group in St. George) We then toured Colorado City. Sister in law and brother in law were amazed that something like this could still exist in the United States.

One Muslim practice in Malaysia is that of “female circumcision”. I asked sister in law if she and brother in law happened to have a little girl would she really want that to happen to their daughter. Sister in law stuttered and then stated that “she would not be Muslim if she did not have this done.” Well, brother in law and sister in law just adopted a baby girl. It makes me sick. I did mention to my sister in law that probably most of us men in the United States were sexually mutilated as babies. They are coming to visit in March.

While in Malaysia, the teenagers in our Muslim family took us fishing. They were using worms. They did not know what “fly fishing” was. So when I got back to Utah I sent them an assortment of colorful flies which they really got a kick out of.

Sorry for the rant, back to the apologists and evolution.

SoUtSkeptic

[helemon]

Check out this kitten.
http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060109/480/nyet27501091906/print;_ylt=AqGLvn5bauTrcLUIuU5C2upsaMYA;_ylu=X3oDM TA3bXNtMmJ2BHNlYwNzc3M-

Ok, the kitten died after birth but it demonstrates clearly that genetics can produce dramatic variations in a species appearance.

[papa]

check out these pigs!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4605202.stm

[free thinker]

check out these pigs!


Flourecent Pigs? Fabulous. If you ever lose your pig in the dark just whip out your trusty blacklight and you'll find em in no time. :rolleyes:

ft

[helemon]

check out these pigs!


Flourecent Pigs? Fabulous. If you ever lose your pig in the dark just whip out your trusty blacklight and you'll find em in no time. :rolleyes:

ft

Now if they could just make glowing hamsters!