Departing Moism - Stages 8 & 9 – Belief Systems Collapse & Rebuild

[Born Free]

Stage 8 of the departing model is Belief Systems Collapse - involves a previous World View or Model of Life, the Universe and Everything collapsing. This could involve many elements: realization that much of the Mormon Model was built upon lies, or finding it inadequate to address your life experience.

DIALECTIC: We sense a new paradigm for all constructs emerging and taking shape. We see the implications of adopting the new paradigm and begin to wonder how we will deal with it. We may attempt some form of horizontal growth to replace our old paradigm and continue to resist vertical growth in order to avoid some of the negative effects.
Stage 9 of the departing model is Belief Systems Rebuild – involves some process of actively creating a new model of Life and Meaning. This may involve some different paths: Into some other religious belief system or the development or adoption of a belief system outside religion.

DIALECTIC: We decide to synthesize. We begin to see that neither our old position nor the “opposition’s” position was the whole story because neither rose to a new paradigm. In the new paradigm (attained through vertical growth) we see that both were correct, in a sense, and we see whole new vistas of meaning and potential.
You might explore the idea of whether the collapse of one model necessarily automatically involves the embrace of a new model, by contrast with rejecting any notion of meaning.
The whole Draft Model thus far is at http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/...hp?t=288&page=2

Preceding threads posted are:
Stage 1 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=339
Stage 2 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=317
Stage 3 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=322
Stage 4 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=324
Stage 5 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=334
Stage 6 - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=340

Ed and I are keen to see who would be interested to flesh out our (all our) understanding of the process of leaving, so propose to initiate a series of threads to elicit more information on each stage.

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?

Did that make moving forward easier to you?

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?

What is now your definition of Spirituality?

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?

We are looking to compare responses to this question to see what patterns (similarities/differences) emerge, so please cut and paste each of the questions, followed by your response/s, so that everyones responses remain in the same sequence.

Daryl

PS: Here are some other threads somewhat related to this stage:

8 – Belief System Collapse

Is the world in meltdown? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=174
I don’t know my own mind now! http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=141
When are you no longer Mo? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=131
Post-Mo Identity http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=28
Is there a God/Jesus? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=37

9 – Belief System Rebuild

Belief.net site – Religion compatibility - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=243
Evolution vs. Creationism - http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=260
Taboos http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=236
Explore your God beliefs http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/...hread.php?t=235
References to God in my programming http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=230
Will Mother Teresa? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=202
Sexual attitudes changed? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=171
Post-Mo Identity http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=28
Values/World View http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/...thread.php?t=76
How do you know you are Post-Mo? http://www.postmormon.org/forum_vb/showthread.php?t=46

[taegan]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)
I dont know if "pushed away" the phrase I'd use, but I noticed that my teachers started treating me like a leper and being hostile toward me.

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?
It took me a long time. I kept the basic beliefs, ie: Jesus died for our sins, if you're good you go to heaven ect ect but I was in NO hurry to look for anything else.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?
Not really. I personally consider myself a Christian, but I've yet to find a Christian church that teaches what I beileve. I've been to a few different churchs and just have not found what I'm looking for.

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?
Yea, I did. When I initially left the church, I really struggled with my belief system. I didnt know what to believe I was terrified that if I didnt believe in SOMETHING, I'd definantly be spending my final days roasting marshmellows with Hitler. At ont point I just told myself that I didnt believe in anything but that was even scarier. Its just been within the last week that I've actually sat down with pen and paper and started writing out exactly what I believe.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)
I'm a person who looks for facts and logic. Certain things in the BOM and Bible just didnt seem logical to me and couldnt understand HOW that would happen (ie: Moses parting the Red Sea is not logical to me, there HAS to be a scientific reason for that happening, if it did indeed happen). So because of that, I started looking for logical reasons for things and that effectively starting pulling me away from the church.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?
I used the internet mostly, but checked out some books from the library on mormonism and books written by historians and scientists who've studied the Bible and BOM. I also went to a few different churches with my friends.

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?
No

Did that make moving forward easier to you?

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?
This is where I currently am and still trying to figure it out.

What is now your definition of Spirituality?
I think that spirituality comes from within. I dont think that just because you read the Bible or go to church, it makes you a spiritual person. For me...I'm still figuring out my own spirituality :confused:

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?
I researched a lot of different religious and scientific beliefs but really never formed a solid opinion on anything. For example, Darwinism. I dont believe we evolved from Apes, but I do believe we have evolved as a species...if that makes sense? God, I dont even know what the hell I believe. Sorry.


What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?


Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?
My belief system totally collasped before I even thought about rebuilding it. I went a long while with not believe anything except in God and Jesus.

[peter_mary]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)

Yes (and when you get to the "Pull Model" question, you'll note that I was like Dr. Doolittle's "Pushme Pullyou" in that I was being pushed and pulled at the same time). As I uncovered the hidden history and original doctrines, I was pushed away at a high rate of speed. I could no longer tolerate the racism, the patriarchy, the "pay for salvation" model, the elitism, the millenialism, etc. I was "repulsed" by all of those.

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?

I was actually building an alternative belief system long before I realized it. When I found myself on the outside of the Church, I was already coming to ground in a newly forming belief system, one which is as open-ended as Mormonism is closed. I believe that this is what made coming out for me relatively easy...I didn't have the void that many others have struggled with.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?

No. As you regular readers of this forum know, I used the same tools to deconstruct Christianity that I used to deconstruct Mormonism. I also felt that once I had regained my ability to think for myself that I couldn't ever give that up. Any system of thinking that required me to turn off my brain was not going to be acceptable to me, and I felt that all the Monotheistic traditions did just that. I know that others feel very differently, but for me, there remained as many nonsensical answers in Christianity as there did in Mormonism.

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?

My belief system is principally one of chaos and ambiguity as principles of the universe, so I am very comfortable sitting in a state of uncertainty. In fact, I insist on it. I try (and often fail) to resist certainty at every turn.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)

Yes. My study of physics, culture, history, religion, and philosophy helped to construct another world view that is much, much broader than Mormonism, and which embraces the fact that Mormonism happens (You've seen those bumber stickers that say, "Shit Happens." Well, "Mormonism Happens" too... :D ) This view was coalescing in my subconscious and conscious mind for years before I finally began the process of exiting, and I think it provided a safe landing spot for me.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?

I read a ton, and talked at every opportunity with my wife and good friends, and continue to do both. I made some use of the internet, but not nearly as much as books.

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?

Yes. I was exposed to Kohlburg's Stages of Moral Development, which I tucked in the back of my brain as I searched elsewhere. I found the most personal resonance with Eastern thought, particularly Taoism and Zen Buddhism, both of which helped me to see Mormonism and Christianity as relatively undeveloped spiritual systems.

Did that make moving forward easier to you?

Actually, no. It did probably help validate the direction I was going, but I don't think it greased the skids, so to speak.

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?

Big question. And I will only answer it from the strictly personal standpoint, as I recognize that many others have come to very different conclusions.

For me, spirituality is what I seek in order to find meaning in my life. What it is that brings that meaning is a constantly evolving dynamic that I play with every day. At the moment, I see myself as participating in the evolving "system" that is "universal consciousness," i.e. the universe finally able to become aware of itself because it has finally evolved to the point where there are conscious beings who can say, "Hey! There's a friggin' universe out there!" In as much as there is SO much for the universe to become aware of, we each contribute to that rapidly expanding "wave" of learning and awareness. Seeing my participation in that enormous process of evolution provides me with a sense of awe and satisfaction...and meaning.

I believe that the many avenues that people use to obtain that sense of spirituality are all as valid as the next...including Mormonism. I believe that most people are genuinely trying to find that meaning and satisfaction, and are better because of it. As is the world. Regardless of what I think of the institutions of religion, I think the PEOPLE are good as a result of that seeking something higher in themselves, their fellow human beings, and the world at large.

What is now your definition of Spirituality?

The inherent will to live skillfully and with purpose. Something like that! :)

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?

Yes, but not as much as the world of science and history. Actually, it was where science crosses over into philosophy that was significant for me. Quantum physics, chaos, complexity, evolution, dynamic systems...these things all eventually come to a place where they begin to address the issues of "where did we come from, why are we here, and where are we going."

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?

This was a parallel process, and to a degree, I was rebuilding BEFORE I was collapsing. But then, I've always had to do things the hard way... :duh

Peter_Mary

[free thinker]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)
Yes, definately! After I found read unfiltered history I didn't want anything to do with it!!


How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?
I didn't. I am still looking at whatever I want, and slowly rebuilding my belief system. It is challenging, and at times somewhat frightenening.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?
No , not at all. I think they are all 90% BS!! Frankly, I am not sure if I am christian anymore.

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?
No. As stated above I am kinda enjoying this.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)
Yes. Absolutely. I am currently reading books that are helping me expand my world view, and consider alternatives.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?
Literature and this web site.

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?

Yes. Reality!! ;)

Did that make moving forward easier to you?
Yes definately!!

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?

I am currently reading John Shelby Spong. I find his view of god is most compatible with what I have felt for many years.


What is now your definition of Spirituality?

Living in harmony with what I perceive to be true. Questioning anything ,and anyone, that supposes authority. I mean anyone and anything!!! Being kind. And that includes to myself. Dumping the useless and counterproductive guilt. Accepting that I am human, and getting life all over me!!

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?
I read it before, but in the context of mormonism. Then it seemed to confirm mormonism. Now it seems to contradict it!! :rolleyes: Perspective eh??

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?

Reading post's here have really challenged me. Man I never knew there was so much to think about!!

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?
It collapsed quikly! I am currently rebuilding. Now where did my trowell go? :)


Free Thinker

[Born Free]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)

I figure that about 50% of my movement was push. I was increasingly repulsed by the laundering, politicking, etc..

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?

I think I never stopped working on my belief system, so it kept getting expanded along the way, even while still Mo. I suspect Moism slowed it quite a bit, with its actively anti-intellectual posturing.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?

The same process and skills that were essential in the deconstruction of Moism, were then applied to Christianity as well. I went through a trauma in life that had me give up completely as God the Divine Rescuer. I remember during that period being pain propelled into tears and anger on a few occasions whilst viewing movies that promoted that idea. I now regard that as belated growing up. I woudl have been early 40s at teh time.

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?

By that point my pain levels were fairly high, so I figured a little more was not going to kill me. Like Peter_Mary, I now regard uncertainity as one of teh operating principles of teh Universe, so rey to be more at pease with it, and am largely happy with my success at that.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)

I have no doubt that alternative models to those offered by Moism were far more utilitarian in my life, and that applied more as I aged and had more life experience and maturity. ON 2nd thoughts I was probably about 60% Pull.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?

Philosophy was a great assistance, mainly via reading. Good websites assisted. Richard Packhams was one that really hit the mark for me. His quotes page is particularly good.

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?

Initially the Values Inventory opened up my awareness to a range of other models of stages of growth, and there was a high level of consistency between those. Jungs work and the various models that grew out of that - Maslow, Kohlburg's Stages of Moral Development, and Ethical Development Stages which grew out of Kohlberg and Ryncarz and just recently via this site, Fowlers Stages of Faith.

All of these had Mormon values, world view, ethics and morality as below 1/2 way on the developmental spectrum.

Did that make moving forward easier to you?

No question it helped greatly. It helpe dreduce the notion actively promoted by Moism that out there (the big bad, evil world) was at best a moral vacuum, at worst wall-to-wall evil.

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?

The baby went with the bathwater for a while, then as I read, thought and felt more, I decided to reclaim spirituality from religion, who I now believe not only never had a monopoly on it, but activelt killed it IMO. I initiated a men's group for a while around the notion of post-religous spirituality.

I listened to an address by Catholic Priest Richard Rohr on Masculine Spirituality, which was a great help in uncoupling spirituality from religion. He uses a great models for stages of life for men and women, which possibly came from someone else, but is very useful.

What is now your definition of Spirituality?

In one of Nathanial Branden's recent books - The Art of Living Consciously, he had a chapter entitled Consciousness and Spirituality. This is the definition he uses and its is close enough to my current working definition:

"Whoever continually strives to achieve a clearer and clearer vision of reality and our place in it - whoever is pulled forward by a passion for clarity - is to that extent leading a spiritual life".

At another point he expanded on the basis for that:

"The word 'spirit,' in its origins, means 'breath'. Spirit pertained to the breath of life. When Aristotle spoke about spirit (or soul) he meant that by virtue of which an organism is alive. To this day, when we speak of a person or a horse who is 'high spirited,' we mean full of life. Or when we speak of a person's spirit being broken, we mean that the person's will to live self-assertively has been extinguished - the life-force has been subdued. So, on this understanding, 'spiritual' would mean pertaining to the life force or the life principle."

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?

Philosophy was invaluable and humbling for me. Stuff Moism messes with and comes with with inane solutions for, philosophers had better nailed over 2,000 years ago. Can't think of anything that stands out.

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?

Good documentaries helped my deconstruction of Christian literalism. Spong was and remains a delight to me. I do not necessarily agree with some of his conclusion, but I value his voice greatly. I admire his mind greatly. Buddhism offers much of value to me.

Branden has been a favourite for years, and his work on self-esteem helped me see how toxic much of Mo thinking was.

Reading and seeing more of history as I have aged has helped. Most stupid mistakes have been made before (repeatedly). Sadly I detested it in high school so wasted soem time in coming to that appreciation. (Says a lot about the education system IMHO)

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?

No, I was expanding my model before I left, but that could have been greatly accelerated if I had got to better material earlier.

[elder_nomo]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)
In the push vs. pull sense, yes pushed. Not so much due to historical or doctrinal problems, but due to loss of "testimony" (no more jingle in the tingle).

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?
I didn't really *seek* a belief system. My beliefs just sort of evolved.
After leaving the Morg, I felt free to think about things that I never had. One of those things was the remote possibility that I might be gay. Extremely remote, mind you - it was the tiniest thought, barely a blip on my personal radar. While in the Morg I had successfully thought-policed myself into total denial / repression / ignorance, whatever you want to call it. I truly did not know I was gay. But then, without mind control, it became quite clear.
Now, I hardly would call discovery of being gay a new "belief system", but it was the second huge personal upheaval in a short period of time (the first being the exit from the Morg), and it did open my mind to all kinds of new thoughts and ideas and ways of looking at the world.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?
About a year later, I moved to San Francisco (Queer Zion). I felt mostly numb about God and religion, but still had a lot of guilt and feelings of unworthiness. Yet, one of the first places I went in SF was a church, Metropolitan Community Church (MCC). The concept of a church accepting gays was unheard of by me (this was 1979) and here, this was a church set up *by* gays. I had to see it for myself.
At my first service, I heard a minister say "You are gay and God loves you just as you are" and I lost it. I felt more love and acceptance and true emotion that one day than I had in 6 years of Mo-ism.
I didn't continue with MCC for long, mostly because of problems with doctrine. I still had a pretty Mo-based interpretation of scriptures, etc. But I have fond memories of how MCC helped heal my heart.

Many years later, I attended a Presbyterian church for a while. I had pretty much become agnostic by then, but I had a partner (aka spousal equivalent) with a strong faith and he asked me to go with him. It meant a lot to him and it seemed harmless (and it actually was) so I did it. When he died, I did not find any solace in scriptures or doctrines or belief. But the lovely people of the church again helped comfort me.

Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?
Yes, and VERY scary. I felt lost, adrift, totally without direction. I feared what I might become without the boundaries of the church.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of 'reality' that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)
No, it was Push Model for me.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?
I realized I couldn't be *sure* of anything anymore (like when I *knew* the church was true), so I pretty much gave up on trying to answer the Big Questions of Life. [It hurt my head. :Crazy: ]

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primative stage of development?
No

Did that make moving forward easier to you?
n/a

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?
I did ultimately reject religion. The word "spirituality" is too loaded for me and I don't even want to try to redefine it for myself. I have trouble removing connotations of mysticism and hocus-pocus.

What is now your definition of Spirituality?
see above.

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anthing stand out?
No, not really.

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?
I read science, politics, and history with a freshly opened mind. More than anything, I started listening to other people instead of just making mental notes about which points I could argue with them and "prove" to them how wrong they were.

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?
Pretty much collapse first, then gradual build. I am not saying "rebuild" because it sort of implies that I replaced my "Mormon belief system" with something equivalent. I guess, in a sense I have done just that, but it really doesn't feel like a "system" to me.
Maybe I'm getting too hung up on the words, like spirituality and belief system, but these words still have a religious sounding quality to me that I don't identify with. I guess that says something right there.

[helemon]

Do you feel you were pushed away from Mormonism as you discovered historical and doctrinal problems? (Push Model)
No. If anything people tried to pull me back by trying to convince me to ignore or dismiss the information I was finding.

How quickly did you seek a replacement belief system?
While I was reading the material about the church I was also reading about other religions. I still find this interesting but have not yet found, nor actively sought a "replacement" belief system.

Did you find any Christian faiths attractive? If not, why not?
I find the Quakers attractive because they also believe that the individual can be inspired and directed by God. I like their idea that just because someone is not a "Christian" does not mean that they are not led by God and will not make it to heaven. I like their belief in the inherent equality of all humans life. I like their lack of formal church hierarchy. I like that they do not have a dogmatic belief in rituals. I like their belief in continued revelation from God. I like their focus on living a simple pious life. I like how they were willing to challenge the power structure of their day with it's feudal classes.


Did you feel stretched in your capacity to sit with discomfort and uncertainty for a bit before embracing a new belief system? How scary was that?
No. I am comfortable at my current place. I don't have a buring desire to find a new religious belief structure to replace mormonism.

Do you feel you were drawn away from Mormonism by other models of ‘reality’ that seemed more viable to you? (Pull Model)
I was pushed away by discovering information that called the official Mormon history into question. I was pushed away because of personal moral objections to past teachings. I was pushed away because of logical inconsistency between Mormon doctrine and my understanding of various scientific knowledge such as evolution, archeology, and astronomy. I was not pulled away by another religion or belief system. I have always had a strong belief in being honest both with other people and with respect to history and had a rational approach to life. Thus when the church could not stand up to that I moved away from that belief structure.

What avenues and resources did you employ to gather alternative models and views?
Beliefnet.com
Mormon book on world religions. This book was interesting in helping me see which religions were close to mormon beliefs. I found the parrallels with pagan religions interesting. It made me wonder about the church being a "restoration" of the early christian church.

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?
??

Did that make moving forward easier to you?
no

If you rejected religion, what do you now think/feel/believe about 'spirituality'?
I am still spiritual and do believe people can and are inspired. I still believe that there are rules about how civilized people should treat each other.

What is now your definition of Spirituality?
Living in harmony with nature. Living with compassion. Living simply and sustainably. Living a mindful life.

Did the world of philosophy inform your journey? Anything stand out?
I read some western philosophy but I wouldn't say it had a large impact on my journey out of mormonism.

What other sources of information on the stages of growth ahead engaged you?

I am confused by this question. Are you refering again to books that show some sort of spiritual progression of an enlightened mind? No nothing inparticular like that influenced me.

Did your Mormon belief system collapse as a stage before rebuild for you, or were they happening in parallel?
?
Mormon belief system didn't "collapse" but whithered and slinked away leaving a more rationally based world view.

[Born Free]

Did you have exposure to any models of spiritual growth that modeled Mormonism as a quite primitive stage of development?

??

Helemon,

Check out this site for a primer:

http://faculty.plts.edu/gpence/html/fowler.htm

Daryl

[helemon]

Helemon,

Check out this site for a primer:

http://faculty.plts.edu/gpence/html/fowler.htm

Daryl
Then the answer is no.