Word of Wisdom - always followed, never led.

[Born Free]

I recently decided to check out where WoW developments sat in the broader US sociological context. It was an interesting view.

Both Grahamism and the Temperance movements preceeded the issuance of the WoW in the early 1800s. As we all know, at that time, it was not taken as mandatory, except when convenient to bolster a Church Court case against someone on the outter.

In the last 1800s Ellen White and the Seventh Day Adventists took their health code much more seriously and they seemed to have run with the anti-sex messages that were in Grahamism, which interestingly Mormonism had not picked up.

Then the US embraced prohibition in the 1920s, but it took over 10 years for Mormonism to get to make the WoW mandatory, which happened to be in the context of the depression by then. Was this part of the well established religous mindset of "We are suffering, so God has caused that as punishment, so we must have #issed off God, so what is it? Oh! It's the Word of Wisdom!" Or too much money is leaving Utard to pay for these commodities, that we could slow, and thereby enhance our economy?

Several things stand out as I looked at the big picture around the WoW.

Moism did NOT embrace the heavy anti-sex message of Grahamism (He encouraged married couples to have sex a maxium of 12 times a year - sap vital juices and all that.)

There was always a major external emphasis on similar issues before the Chruch moved.

Despite that meat ingestion gets 3 verses in the WoW, which is more than any other element currently sanctioned, the Church has never emphasised moderate meat consumption. Is that because meat was so important to the Utah and regions economy?

Church members love to stress how prophetic Joseph's warning was re "evil men in the latter days', but he never spoke about anything that there was not already strong or emerging resistance against. To have been truely prophetic, in my mind, he would have to stress something not known at the time, like hard drugs, or excessive sugar consumption and its potential diabetes risk.

But there is no such 'vision'.

Has anyone made and placed an interpretation on the omissions and failures from emphaisis - sex and meat eating?

Daryl

[free thinker]

I am not going to comment on your question, but I would like to add this to the thread.

What of drinking coffee? What are the deliterious effects? The answer! There are none! So what of the coffee thing? Dont fall into the trap of CAFFIENE!! Mormons eat more chocolate, wich is loaded with caffiene, than any other people in the history of the world!

It is easy to point out the negative effects of alchohol consumption, but as you say, Joseph Smith gleaned this from societal events. These were not revealed, and he certainly did not think of them. After all, they were still drinking wine in Liberty Jail!!

The WOW is just another made up "revelation" by Joseph Smith! Can you imagine saying to regular folks, who are quite good as humans, heaven is closed to you, because you enjoy the occasional adult beverage! Nonsense! I aint buyin it! If God is like that, I don't wanna be where he is anyway!!

Free Thinker

[free thinker]

Limit SEX ? Joseph Smith? :D C,mon man. Are you kidding? This guy got more than Hugh Hefner at a condom convention!! He would never have "revealed" anything that curtailed sex!! ;)

Free Thinker

[bigeddy]

For Silverfox, The Rest of the Story. Masturbation was believed to deplete the needed male essence (Depletion Theory) and it was believed that various aspects of a wholesome life tended to reduce the temptation to participate. Dr. Kellogg introduced cornflakes as an anti-masturbation food because eating grains was one of those aspects of a wholesome life that discouraged masturbation (as they believed). It is interesting that Joe included the eating of grain as part of the WofW but did not get into the whole bit. I guess he did not want to participate in the Depletion Theory stuff as he was enjoying the orgasms too much.

Ed

[Born Free]

I am not going to comment on your question, but I would like to add this to the thread.

What of drinking coffee? What are the deliterious effects? The answer! There are none! So what of the coffee thing? Dont fall into the trap of CAFFIENE!! Mormons eat more chocolate, wich is loaded with caffiene, than any other people in the history of the world!

It is easy to point out the negative effects of alchohol consumption, but as you say, Joseph Smith gleaned this from societal events. These were not revealed, and he certainly did not think of them. After all, they were still drinking wine in Liberty Jail!!

The WOW is just another made up "revelation" by Joseph Smith! Can you imagine saying to regular folks, who are quite good as humans, heaven is closed to you, because you enjoy the occasional adult beverage! Nonsense! I aint buyin it! If God is like that, I don't wanna be where he is anyway!!

Free Thinker


Freethinker,

While I will bucket the WoW when it is really deserving, based on all I see, I continue to treat coffee with great respect. It is a powerful drug, and based on the best medical advice I see, I limit my intake to 2 cups a day, more often 1. (Mind you if I am going to have some, I won't have any of the instant garbage - only fresh ground and brewed.)

I am familiar with research that tested for its capacity to 'enliven' the brain, which concluded people could work faster, but that their accuracy dropped off - net effect a loss. Spiders administered a proportionate dose, built crazy dysfunctional webs.

It is also commonly linked to insomnia, and irritable bowel syndrome, to name just a few.

In a word - moderation in all things.

Daryl

[Born Free]

For Silverfox, The Rest of the Story. Masturbation was believed to deplete the needed male essence (Depletion Theory) and it was believed that various aspects of a wholesome life tended to reduce the temptation to participate. Dr. Kellogg introduced cornflakes as an anti-masturbation food because eating grains was one of those aspects of a wholesome life that discouraged masturbation (as they believed). It is interesting that Joe included the eating of grain as part of the WofW but did not get into the whole bit. I guess he did not want to participate in the Depletion Theory stuff as he was enjoying the orgasms too much.

Ed

Check out this website. Blatant fiddling with the truth was still rampant as recently as 1939.

http://www.mends.com.au/mends%20humour.htm

BTW, porridge was supposed to be more likely to lead to masturbation! Now, I have known some kinky bods in my time, but tumessing over your porridge takes kinky to a whole new stratosphere. :eek:

[free thinker]

Freethinker,

While I will bucket the WoW when it is really deserving, based on all I see, I continue to treat coffee with great respect. It is a powerful drug, and based on the best medical advice I see, I limit my intake to 2 cups a day, more often 1. (Mind you if I am going to have some, I won't have any of the instant garbage - only fresh ground and brewed.)

I am familiar with research that tested for its capacity to 'enliven' the brain, which concluded people could work faster, but that their accuracy dropped off - net effect a loss. Spiders administered a proportionate dose, built crazy dysfunctional webs.

It is also commonly linked to insomnia, and irritable bowel syndrome, to name just a few.

In a word - moderation in all things.

Daryl


I was not aware of these findings! Thanks for the info!

Perhaps I will limit my intake! I must say though, that I usually only drink decaf, and have not experienced any of the above side effects.

Thanks

Free Thinker

[Born Free]

I was not aware of these findings! Thanks for the info!

Perhaps I will limit my intake! I must say though, that I usually only drink decaf, and have not experienced any of the above side effects.

Thanks

Free Thinker

Free Thinker,

There were some really bizarre research findings on decaf just last year, that have yet to be explained. It found that decaf produced in people many of the same physiological responses as caffinated coffee - elevated heat rate etc.

It was a really bizarre finding around responses that had previously been attributed to the caffeine.

Go figure. I regard the jury as still out!

[peter_mary]

Free Thinker,

There were some really bizarre research findings on decaf just last year, that have yet to be explained. It found that decaf produced in people many of the same physiological responses as caffinated coffee - elevated heat rate etc.

It was a really bizarre finding around responses that had previously been attributed to the caffeine.

Go figure. I regard the jury as still out!

Let me set the stage. I'm standing on a wharf early in the morning on the Oregon coast, surrounded by fishing boats. There's light fog, the air is cool, wet and dead calm. There is only the occassional cry of gull and the splash out in the bay of a sea lion who came up for a breath and was gone again. Me...I'm walking in that early morning, jacket pulled up around my neck to keep back the cold, and in my hand is a fresh, hot coffee with a shot of cherry...a black forest mocha, double shot of espresso. I've been out of the Church for roughly 3 months, and I'm having my very first espresso beverage. And I'm incredibly happy.

That was almost 5 years ago, and while I limit my espresso intake to a few a week (for calorie reasons more than caffeine), whenever I sip that sweet, hot liquid, I am taken back to the morning on the coast when I took back my freedom to choose...and I was truly content.

The Jury is in for me, and coffee is exhonerated. Daryl is right...moderation in all things, including water. Healthy living is about balance and reason, not excess. And in this regard, I will enjoy this particular vice for the rest of my life in small quantities.

Paul

[Born Free]

Let me set the stage. I'm standing on a wharf early in the morning on the Oregon coast, surrounded by fishing boats. There's light fog, the air is cool, wet and dead calm. There is only the occassional cry of gull and the splash out in the bay of a sea lion who came up for a breath and was gone again. Me...I'm walking in that early morning, jacket pulled up around my neck to keep back the cold, and in my hand is a fresh, hot coffee with a shot of cherry...a black forest mocha, double shot of espresso. I've been out of the Church for roughly 3 months, and I'm having my very first espresso beverage. And I'm incredibly happy.

Paul

Paul,

You create a great wordscape!

That coffee had a lot of symbolism packed into it. Marketers would kill to imbue their product with that sort of associated perceived value!

Sounds like a sacrament - like throwing off the bonds of sin - (well damnation anyway!) Does that qualify it as a spiritual coffee?

Enjoy!

Daryl